http://in.reuters.com/assets/print?a...58703620110809

"Tue, Aug 9 2011

Nokia aims to release the first cellphone supporting GLONASS as well
as GPS next year, the head of GLONASS operator NIS GLONASS told
Reuters.

'It is possible that already by the end of next year most Nokia
cellphones will be equipped with chipsets supporting both GLONASS and
GPS, and we hope other vendors will follow,' Alexander Gurko, chief
executive of NIS GLONASS, said in an interview.

He said a dozen global chipmakers, including Qualcomm Inc, Broadcom
Corp and STMicroelectronics, are already developing GLONASS/GPS
chipsets, leading to greater penetration of the technology in consumer
markets."

" 'We expect that by 2020 ... global penetration of GLONASS will
exceed 5-10 percent.' "

Didn't find anything on Nokia's web site about dual system phones,
though it may be there somewhere.

Qualcomm announced a product 3 months ago:

http://www.qualcomm.com/news/release...nd-glonass-sat

"May 23, 2011 – . . . The first GLONASS capable phone is the MTS 945
from ZTE, powered by Qualcomm’s Snapdragon MSM7x30™ chipset. . . .
Support for both satellite networks is currently integrated into
Qualcomm’s Snapdragon MSM7x30 chipset and software solution and will
be supported moving forward on select Snapdragon and feature phone
chipsets with Qualcomm’s latest GPS engine.

'ZTE is first to market with a smartphone that supports both the GPS
and GLONASS satellite systems, taking full advantage of the
functionality which has been integrated into our Snapdragon MSM7x30
chipset and software,' said Raj Talluri, vice president of product
management for Qualcomm. 'Supporting both positioning technologies
gives users of ZTE’s latest smartphone the benefit of up to 55
different satellites when calculating their global position for
navigation or any location-based application. The result is more
accurate location performance, all over the world, particularly in
challenging urban environments where the combination of narrow streets
and tall buildings can degrade accuracy.' "

Didn't find anything else on that Snapdragon chipset on the Qualcomm
site.

Broadcom was even earlier:

http://www.broadcom.com/press/release.php?id=s548720

"Feb. 9, 2011 -- Broadcom Corporation . . . today announced the
upgrade of its Assisted-GPS (A-GPS) data service to support the
delivery of GLONASS . . . assistance data for mobile and personal
navigation device (PND) users. This service supports two new Broadcom®
GPS system-on-a-chip (SoC) solutions . . . that feature dual
constellation support for GPS and GLONASS:

BCM47511 standalone GPS SoC solution
BCM2076 super combination (combo) chip featuring integrated
Bluetooth and FM tuner functionality.

In addition to this upgraded A-GPS service, Broadcom also announces
that it has upgraded its current GPS Long Term Orbit (LTO) data
product and service to support the GLONASS constellation starting with
today's introduction of the BCM47511 and BCM2076 GPS SoC solutions.
LTO extends the usability of GPS and GLONASS assistance data for up to
7 days and ensures the fastest possible fix time in mobile wireless
devices."

http://www.broadcom.com/products/GPS...tions/BCM47511

"The BCM47511 is the latest generation of standalone, Global
Navigation Satellite System (GNSS) solutions, adding GLONASS
functionality, while remaining pin-compatible to the popular BCM4751
GPS SoC solution so customers can quickly upgrade their products to
include the benefits of GLONASS navigation support. The BCM47511 also
supports the Space Based Augmentation (SBAS) and Quasi-Zenith
Satellite System (QZSS) constellations to deliver the best possible
navigation performance in any geography."

And ST Microelectronics::

STA8088EX High flexible GPS/Galileo/Glonass/QZSS receiver with
powerful processing (ARM9)

http://www.st.com/internet/com/TECHN...CD00295372.pdf

A few slides on Teseo II in this briefing:

http://www.st.com/internet/com/SALES...eting_pres.pdf

A day after the Reuters interview, an opinion:

http://eandt.theiet.org/blog/blogpos...2398&catid=394

"In April this year, one well known Russian mobile phone reviewer,
Eldar Mutazin, dismissed the first Russian handset to come on to the
market with Glonass capabilities, called MTS Glonass 945, for being
twice as expensive, the equivalent of £250 [$413 at today's rate], as
handsets with only GPS. The Russian government is considering a 25%
tax on foreign handsets that do not have Glonass installed, and that
may have been a contributing reason behind Nokia's decision. The
Finnish company sells hundreds of thousands of handsets in Russia each
year.

Nokia is the first international handset maker to adopt the Russian
system. Talks are said to be under way with Motorola too."

On 2011-08-17 21:13 , Ed M. wrote:
> http://in.reuters.com/assets/print?a...58703620110809
>
> "Tue, Aug 9 2011
>
> Nokia aims to release the first cellphone supporting GLONASS as well


I'd like to see a commercial receiver along the lines of a Magellan or
Garmin that employs both constellations simultaneously. Could (should)
be of great use in urban and real canyons, mountains and perhaps in
wooded areas as well.


--
gmail originated posts filtered due to spam.

On 18/08/2011 14:45, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2011-08-17 21:13 , Ed M. wrote:
>> http://in.reuters.com/assets/print?a...58703620110809
>>
>> "Tue, Aug 9 2011
>>
>> Nokia aims to release the first cellphone supporting GLONASS as well
>
>
> I'd like to see a commercial receiver along the lines of a Magellan or
> Garmin that employs both constellations simultaneously. Could (should)
> be of great use in urban and real canyons, mountains and perhaps in
> wooded areas as well.

The new eTrex 10 / eTrex 20 / eTrex 30 will do this.
Available in September apparently.


--
Craig Wallace
http://craig.neogeo.org.uk
http://www.neogeo.org.uk

On 2011-08-18 09:55 , Craig Wallace wrote:
> On 18/08/2011 14:45, Alan Browne wrote:
>> On 2011-08-17 21:13 , Ed M. wrote:
>>> http://in.reuters.com/assets/print?a...58703620110809
>>>
>>> "Tue, Aug 9 2011
>>>
>>> Nokia aims to release the first cellphone supporting GLONASS as well
>>
>>
>> I'd like to see a commercial receiver along the lines of a Magellan or
>> Garmin that employs both constellations simultaneously. Could (should)
>> be of great use in urban and real canyons, mountains and perhaps in
>> wooded areas as well.
>
> The new eTrex 10 / eTrex 20 / eTrex 30 will do this.
> Available in September apparently.

Thanks! ( Okay, I'm lazy ).

--
gmail originated posts filtered due to spam.

On Thu, 18-th Aug 2011 09:45:23 -0400, Alan Browne wrote:

>> Nokia aims to release the first cellphone supporting GLONASS as well
>
> I'd like to see a commercial receiver along the lines of a Magellan or
> Garmin that employs both constellations simultaneously.

Topcon (GMS-2, GRS-1) has done this for "ages". Although it depends,
what you regard as "commercial receiver" class. Both Topcon devices
probably /start/ at 4.000 $ (depending on configuration)... ;-)

> Could (should) be of great use in urban and real canyons, mountains and
> perhaps in wooded areas as well.

We currently use a batch of GRS-1 with GPS/GLONASS in the forests and
have exceptionally good results. External antenna is mandatory, though.
While the internal antennae isn't bad, the results improve noticeably
with an extern one.

Last time I looked, Beacon (BR-1 via bluetooth) was only supported for
GPS. But the firmware supporting GLONASS signal correction was on the
way. Since the GLONASS support hasn't been added to our local beacon
transmitters (half a year overdue, at the moment), this isn't soo
important. But, when it is up and working, I expect /real/ submeter
under average dry canopy in most cases with L1 GPS, GLONASS and Beacon
correction for both signals. At the moment, it is rather somewhat "sub
2-3 meter" with /either/ "GPS & Beacon" /or/ "GPS & GLONASS".

Bernd

On 2011-08-19 12:29 , Bernd Rose wrote:
> On Thu, 18-th Aug 2011 09:45:23 -0400, Alan Browne wrote:
>
>>> Nokia aims to release the first cellphone supporting GLONASS as well
>>
>> I'd like to see a commercial receiver along the lines of a Magellan or
>> Garmin that employs both constellations simultaneously.
>
> Topcon (GMS-2, GRS-1) has done this for "ages". Although it depends,
> what you regard as "commercial receiver" class. Both Topcon devices
> probably /start/ at 4.000 $ (depending on configuration)... ;-)
>
>> Could (should) be of great use in urban and real canyons, mountains and
>> perhaps in wooded areas as well.
>
> We currently use a batch of GRS-1 with GPS/GLONASS in the forests and
> have exceptionally good results. External antenna is mandatory, though.
> While the internal antennae isn't bad, the results improve noticeably
> with an extern one.
>
> Last time I looked, Beacon (BR-1 via bluetooth) was only supported for
> GPS. But the firmware supporting GLONASS signal correction was on the
> way. Since the GLONASS support hasn't been added to our local beacon
> transmitters (half a year overdue, at the moment), this isn't soo
> important. But, when it is up and working, I expect /real/ submeter
> under average dry canopy in most cases with L1 GPS, GLONASS and Beacon
> correction for both signals. At the moment, it is rather somewhat "sub
> 2-3 meter" with /either/ "GPS& Beacon" /or/ "GPS& GLONASS".

The Garmin eTrex look promising. Just hope to see a detailed spec real
soon.

The -30 looks esp. good with color relief maps built in, compass, altimeter.

I just want to see a more full spec on channels (GPS/GLONASS) how the
algorithms use GLONASS (is it pretty much equal waiting, all possible
sats used; some form of RAIM; SBAS; etc.; ).

I'd like more details on how it integrates (if at all) the altimeter.

--
gmail originated posts filtered due to spam.

On Aug 19, 1:55*pm, Alan Browne <alan.bro...@FreelunchVideotron.ca>
wrote:
> On 2011-08-19 12:29 , Bernd Rose wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Thu, 18-th Aug 2011 09:45:23 -0400, Alan Browne wrote:
>
> >>> Nokia aims to release the first cellphone supporting GLONASS as well
>
> >> I'd like to see a commercial receiver along the lines of a Magellan or
> >> Garmin that employs both constellations simultaneously.
>
> > Topcon (GMS-2, GRS-1) has done this for "ages". Although it depends,
> > what you regard as "commercial receiver" class. Both Topcon devices
> > probably /start/ at 4.000 $ (depending on configuration)... *;-)
>
> >> Could (should) be of great use in urban and real canyons, mountains and
> >> perhaps in wooded areas as well.
>
> > We currently use a batch of GRS-1 with GPS/GLONASS in the forests and
> > have exceptionally good results. External antenna is mandatory, though.
> > While the internal antennae isn't bad, the results improve noticeably
> > with an extern one.
>
> > Last time I looked, Beacon (BR-1 via bluetooth) was only supported for
> > GPS. But the firmware supporting GLONASS signal correction was on the
> > way. Since the GLONASS support hasn't been added to our local beacon
> > transmitters (half a year overdue, at the moment), this isn't soo
> > important. But, when it is up and working, I expect /real/ submeter
> > under average dry canopy in most cases with L1 GPS, GLONASS and Beacon
> > correction for both signals. At the moment, it is rather somewhat "sub
> > 2-3 meter" with /either/ "GPS& *Beacon" /or/ "GPS& *GLONASS".
>
> The Garmin eTrex look promising. *Just hope to see a detailed spec real
> soon.
>
> The -30 looks esp. good with color relief maps built in, compass, altimeter.
>
> I just want to see a more full spec on channels (GPS/GLONASS) how the
> algorithms use GLONASS (is it pretty much equal waiting, all possible
> sats used; some form of RAIM; SBAS; etc.; ).
>
> I'd like more details on how it integrates (if at all) the altimeter.
>
> --
> gmail originated posts filtered due to spam.

Before you know it, all equipment with a GPS receiver will be forced
to support GLONASS and Compass. The typical way of dictatorships,
force everything down other's throats. We might also have the E.U.
requiring Galileo support (support for Galileo/QZSS should happen
naturally with time anyways, due to the sheer economical importance of
Europe and Japan).

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Marcelo

On 2011-08-19 14:49 , macpacheco wrote:
>
> Before you know it, all equipment with a GPS receiver will be forced
> to support GLONASS and Compass. The typical way of dictatorships,
> force everything down other's throats. We might also have the E.U.
> requiring Galileo support (support for Galileo/QZSS should happen
> naturally with time anyways, due to the sheer economical importance of
> Europe and Japan).

There is no basis, rationale or reason that supports the above.


--
gmail originated posts filtered due to spam.

On Aug 19, 5:56*pm, Alan Browne <alan.bro...@FreelunchVideotron.ca>
wrote:
> On 2011-08-19 14:49 , macpacheco wrote:
>
>
>
> > Before you know it, all equipment with a GPS receiver will be forced
> > to support GLONASS and Compass. The typical way of dictatorships,
> > force everything down other's throats. We might also have the E.U.
> > requiring Galileo support (support for Galileo/QZSS should happen
> > naturally with time anyways, due to the sheer economical importance of
> > Europe and Japan).
>
> There is no basis, rationale or reason that supports the above.
>
> --
> gmail originated posts filtered due to spam.

Call it foresight... Nationalistic/Protectionism will lead to that as
far as China/Compass is concerned. For now China's primary strategic
interest is giving the Chinese industry the technological monopoly on
Compass, so they aren't publishing the ICDs for foreign companies, but
once they have the lead, the natural progression is to require all
GNSS equipment sold in China to have Compass support (I don't know if
this will happen before or after they provide the ICDs to the rest of
the world).

Perhaps you don't follow how thing happens outside the US, in places
where economic liberalism doesn't exist or is a lie.
Brazil adopted Japan's HDTV system, but changed it just enough that
you can't purchase Japanese HDTV over the air equipment, it won't work
in Brazil. For 25 years, Brazilian tripolar power plug was the
american format (the usual power plug for computer systems, power
+neutral+ground), less than a year ago, Brazil's stupid nationalistic
government decided to create a national tripolar power plug and to
essentially outlaw the format used before, at a US$ 1 billion cost to
our dumb population that accepts this kind of ripoff !

Why do we need about a dozen different power plugs worldwide ? Due to
national interests of course.

Europe is a little diferent, because the population will scream bloody
murder if they require Galileo support, but there as well as in Japan,
Galileo/QZSS support will become a norm (without the need for
regulation) due to the sheer economic weight / national pride of the
involved countries.

Marcelo Pacheco

On 2011-08-21 23:07 , macpacheco wrote:
> On Aug 19, 5:56 pm, Alan Browne<alan.bro...@FreelunchVideotron.ca>
> wrote:
>> On 2011-08-19 14:49 , macpacheco wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> Before you know it, all equipment with a GPS receiver will be forced
>>> to support GLONASS and Compass. The typical way of dictatorships,
>>> force everything down other's throats. We might also have the E.U.
>>> requiring Galileo support (support for Galileo/QZSS should happen
>>> naturally with time anyways, due to the sheer economical importance of
>>> Europe and Japan).
>>
>> There is no basis, rationale or reason that supports the above.
>>
>> --
>> gmail originated posts filtered due to spam.
>
> Call it foresight... Nationalistic/Protectionism will lead to that as
> far as China/Compass is concerned. For now China's primary strategic

They can shoot themselves in the foot all day long for all I care.

If, for example, Garmin are told they must include Compass in a receiver
made in China, then Garmin would simply move production to Taiwan,
Singapore, S. Korea, Thailand, Vietnam and so on - unless there is a
great demand for Compass.

With GPS, GLONASS and Galileo there will not be a lot of demand for
Compass. Those needing high quality for long periods will lean towards
GPS and Galileo.

Nobody trusts the Russians much to maintain quality of service over the
long term.

Nobody trusts the Chinese at all.

> Brazil adopted Japan's HDTV system, but changed it just enough that
> you can't purchase Japanese HDTV over the air equipment, it won't work
> in Brazil.

So Brazil's government is stupid. Throw them out.

> For 25 years, Brazilian tripolar power plug was the
> american format (the usual power plug for computer systems, power
> +neutral+ground), less than a year ago, Brazil's stupid nationalistic
> government decided to create a national tripolar power plug and to
> essentially outlaw the format used before, at a US$ 1 billion cost to
> our dumb population that accepts this kind of ripoff !

It's called standardization. One day you have to bite.

> Europe is a little diferent, because the population will scream bloody
> murder if they require Galileo support, but there as well as in Japan,
> Galileo/QZSS support will become a norm (without the need for
> regulation) due to the sheer economic weight / national pride of the
> involved countries.

Europeans will adopt Galileo as needed because it provides a needed
service. There will be no urgency to adopt it where GPS is providing
acceptable service. There will be, of course, companies touting
redundancy, safety and European pride, but in the end adoption of
Galileo will be led by real need, government spending and lastly 'pride'
of product.

All that to say that, except for stupid nationalist goals, there will be
no enforced inclusion of receivers in products that people will actually
want to buy. And there will be sufficient alternate sources to bypass
such stupidity.

--
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